Contrarian thinking

Give the English and Welsh a referendum on leaving UK

Following Brexit previously pro UK Scots now want independence, break up is inevitable.  Scottish independence would be a lose/lose divorce.  But independence of England and Wales from the UK would be win/win.

English/Welsh independence:

Win: The UK (Scotland and NI) can remain in the EU (as per their wishes), there is no need for them to spend years applying to join in their own right. On leaving the UK, England and Wales would automatically trigger their exit from Europe.

Win: Northern Ireland peace process.  No Brexit (which would be in conflict with the Good Friday peace Agreement on Ireland border controls).  Nationalists are more likely to reach agreements with a UK that does not include England. The Scots are historically Irish Gaels.  They may wish to reform the UK into a Gael Union with Eire, acceptable to both Irish Nationalists and Unionists.  Conversely a UK without Scotland will reinforce Nationalist perceptions of a NI dominated and occupied by England.

Win: England & Wales are finally rid of the Northern Ireland political problem. And if both wish, can re-form their own union.

Win: The English and Welsh (as per the terms offered to Scotland in 2014) will still have the right to British EU passports.  Under Brexit AND Scottish Independence the rest of the UK would lose the automatic right to work in Scotland and the EU. However, (future) members of the EU, the Scots, would still be able to take jobs in E&W, even during times of high unemployment for our own citizens. The alternative English/Welsh UK passports option would benefit all nations – see next point.

Win: More high paid jobs for Scotland, less job losses for English/Welsh nationals.  As a result of Brexit, banks will be moving some operations (and jobs) to the EU.  Under English/Welsh independence Scotland would remain in the EU without a gap and therefore be a viable option for this relocation.   As the banks existing knowledgebase of English/Welsh employees will still have British Passports they could transfer to Scotland without visas making Edinburgh the preferred choice over Frankfurt which would require work visas for essential key English and Welsh employees.

To achieve this solution we need to push for it rapidly before our Government invokes EU Article 50.

The English are the only nation that has been denied their democratic rights on a vote on independence.  I am not aware of any enforceable UK or International law/constitution that gives the English less right to self determination than the other 3 nations.

I need 5 supporters to submit this as a Gov petition.  Any volunteers?????


  1. Alex Fogwill

    This is a novel solution to the problem of the disparity in the voting patterns from the EU referendum…but the problem is that to get to this outcome we have to surrender the United Kingdom, or our participation within it. Is this really something you are actively seeking?
    I don’t think we have to assume the Scots will get, or indeed ask for, independence from the UK. Economically they could not afford it with the continuing low price of oil and the cost of contributing to the EU even if they were to be successful in joining. I know their renowned passion could overrule their logic but I would be surprised if they were given the opportunity by the political leadership.

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